“If you want a reaction out of this board, I can tell you, you’ll probably get it”: State Board of Education discusses Certain’s Facebook post and “lack of decorum” at SBAC meetings

BY JENNIFER CABRERA

FORT WALTON BEACH, Fla. – At today’s State Board of Education (BOE) meeting, the Commissioner of Education criticized School Board of Alachua County (SBAC) Vice Chair Tina Certain’s recent Facebook post, the Board learned that Alachua County Public Schools was the only district in the state that didn’t file a report on security incidents, Certain was summoned to the November BOE meeting, and SBAC’s appeal of a charter granted to the Newberry Community School was denied.

Kamoutsas: “Holding educators accountable for statements that celebrate or even endorse school violence is not a violation of their First Amendment rights.”

Commissioner of Education Anastasios Kamoutsas began his report by saying, “Charlie Kirk was a dedicated conservative Christian and devoted family man. At only 31 years old, he was taken from this world far too soon, leaving behind a wonderful wife and two beautiful children. The notion that anyone, especially our educators, who are responsible for the health, safety, and welfare of our students, would post content on social media celebrating and promoting violence in schools is reprehensible and will not be tolerated… We will not allow a culture that glorifies violence in schools here in Florida. We need to make it very clear that someone who committed an assassination on a school campus cannot be celebrated, ever. What happened on that school campus was pure evil, and we must ensure our students know this is not how we deal with someone that we disagree with.” 

Kamoutsas continued, “Holding educators accountable for statements that celebrate or even endorse school violence is not a violation of their First Amendment rights. Educators and faculty must recognize that their words carry significant influence, both inside and outside of the classroom, while with the privilege of shaping young minds comes the responsibility to model the highest standards of integrity, judgment, and professionalism.”

Kamoutsas: “We continue to be concerned about the toxic culture that has infiltrated school board meetings in Alachua County, as parents have been targeted simply for voicing their conservative opinions during the public comments.”

Moving to the topic of the School Board of Alachua County, Kamoutsas said, “At the last State Board of Education meeting, the Board voted to use their oversight authority to hold the Alachua County School Board members accountable for their violations of the First Amendment parental rights and state law during their board meetings. The Department has been monitoring the Alachua County School Board meetings to ensure that no future violations occur. We continue to be concerned about the toxic culture that has infiltrated school board meetings in Alachua County, as parents have been targeted simply for voicing their conservative opinions during the public comments.”

Kamoutsas: “Alachua County is the only district in the state that failed to submit their SESIR data.”

Kamoutsas also said that Alachua County Public Schools (ACPS) had not submitted its SESIR (School Environment Safety Incident Reporting) data, which tracks incidents and analyzes patterns of violent and disruptive activity at schools: “Alachua County is the only district in the state that failed to submit their SESIR data.”

ACPS Public Information Officer Jackie Johnson told Alachua Chronicle this afternoon that the data has been sent. 

State expects district and union to enter into a salary agreement by October 1

Kamoutsas also said he expects the teachers’ union and ACPS to have a salary agreement, “or at least a plan, in place by October 1.”

Kamoutsas on Vice Chair Certain’s Facebook post: “For a School Board Member to post this after I wrote a memo with clear guidance and expectations of educators upholding the ethical and professional standards of the profession is especially egregious.”

Kamoutsas continued, “Not to mention, members of the Board have also participated in the vile posts being made on social media. Now, this may not be a surprise to you, considering that the Board Chair, Sarah Rockwell, recently celebrated on social media the death of Hulk Hogan. Well, now Vice Chair Certain of the Alachua County School Board made a post that was equally vile.” 

Certain’s recent Facebook post was shown on the screen, and Kamoutsas read it: “I didn’t watch any of that Drump rally! I went to see an elder bcs the weight of it all – how a 31yr old uneducated white boy has been glorified. He has a organization bcs a millionaire gave him money & connections to start it. To see the feds & state elevate him angers me. It is heavy but I know I can’t stay home. Gotta fight despite being tired of it all.”

Kamoutsas commented, “For a school board member to post this after I wrote a memo with clear guidance and expectations of educators upholding the ethical and professional standards of the profession is especially egregious.”

Executive Director of the Bureau of School Improvement Dustin Sims: “Overall, the [September 2] meeting lacked decorum and organization. The absence of structure resulted in evident confusion among Board Members, in which Chair Certain did not establish a clear professional tone for the meeting. If this is a recurring pattern, it raises serious concerns about the Board’s ability to effectively serve the constituents of Alachua County.”

When the board reached the “Update on the Alachua County School Board” agenda item, Dustin Sims, Lead State Executive Director of the Bureau of School Improvement, said he attended the September 2 SBAC meeting: “For context for the Board, Alachua County has a documented history of schools moving in and out of School Improvement status, with multiple schools consistently earning D or F grades. At present, the Bureau of School Improvement is actively supporting three Alachua County schools with urgency to raise their performance to a grade of C or higher… Vice Chair Tina Certain served as the acting Chair during the September 2 meeting, once again assuming this role in place of Chair Sarah Rockwell.”

Sims: “Questions, comments, and opinions were often intermixed, and Chair Certain frequently interjected with informal commentary, rather than providing structured guidance according to the Board rules.”

Sims continued, “Overall, the meeting lacked decorum and organization. The absence of structure resulted in evident confusion among Board Members, in which Chair Certain did not establish a clear professional tone for the meeting. If this is a recurring pattern, it raises serious concerns about the Board’s ability to effectively serve the constituents of Alachua County. In fact, at one point, Board Members moved a purchasing item from [the consent agenda] to [an action item]. Now, while moving agenda items is not inherently problematic, the questions posed by the Board Members demonstrated minimal preparation or advance review, which are essential responsibilities of elected officials. Questions, comments, and opinions were often intermixed, and Chair Certain frequently interjected with informal commentary, rather than providing structured guidance according to the Board rules. This lack of leadership made the meeting difficult to follow, even as a professional educator of 25 years who has attended many board meetings, and I’m familiar with these topics, so it significantly reduced the accessibility of the general public. A key concern, though, is that if this level of informality persists during routine meetings, it raises strong doubts about the Board’s readiness to handle more contentious or active discussions.”

Sims: “In fact, the lack of decorum at the September 2 Alachua County School Board Meeting reinforced the relevance of the State Board’s concerns that without clear leadership and structure, board meetings are prone to confusion and confrontation.”

Referring to Certain’s comments at the end of the meeting (click here to read her comments), Sims said, “Most concerning, however, was Chair Certain’s recounting of her attendance at the August 20 State Board of Education Meeting. Her comments suggested skepticism regarding both the fairness of the process and the selection of the videos as presented evidence. This response indicates to me that the Alachua [County] School Board may not fully intend to implement the corrective and remedial measures mandated by the State Board. I, too, attended the State Board of Education meeting on August 20; I did not observe any reason to question the context or validity of the videos shown at that meeting. In fact, the lack of decorum at the September 2 Alachua County School Board Meeting reinforced the relevance of the State Board’s concerns that without clear leadership and structure, Board meetings are prone to confusion and confrontation.”

BOE Member Layla Collins: “Do we see a way that this pattern can be broken and that it can improve, or is there a complete lack of willingness?”

BOE Member Layla Collins said, “I think I made it very clear in the last meeting that I look for patterns, because we all can extend grace when there is a willingness to do better, but what I’m hearing is, the pattern existed for a long time, and it’s continuing, and I find that to be very concerning. And then with the recent post we’ve discussed, I don’t even see a willingness to do better, because our children are a gift from God. When we give our child for the day to go to a place to gain an education, we, as parents and as a public school parent, expect that they’re all going to be there and have a fair shake. But when you refer to a dead father that was politically assassinated as a white boy that was uneducated, and you’re mad that he was glorified in the same online conversation where you demean our President that has just survived multiple political assassination attempts — I don’t understand how we would break this pattern, and that is the basis of my concern: Do we see a way that this pattern can be broken and that it can improve, or is there a complete lack of willingness?”

Sims responded, “I’ve been able to attend multiple meetings of the Alachua County School Board, and I can tell you that the reality of my visit that night at the September 2 meeting is the reality of each and every one of the Board meetings that I’ve attended in Alachua County. There is a lack of decorum that continually follows each of those meetings, no matter who the Chair of the Board may be on that particular night.”

BOE Member MaryLynn Magar: “It seems that they’re trying to get a reaction out of us. And, you know, if you want a reaction out of this board, I can tell you, you’ll probably get it.”

BOE Member MaryLynn Magar said, “I see this pattern of bullying. It seems the School Board is bullying parents and students and baiting us over and over again. I mean, Commissioner, when you talked about this school safety data not coming in on time,… it seems that they’re trying to get a reaction out of us. And, you know, if you want a reaction out of this board, I can tell you, you’ll probably get it.”

BOE Vice Chair Esther Byrd said, “I’m out of words at this point… I just want to know what the next steps are, because this isn’t workable. It just can’t continue like this. So I just want to know what our options are, because I’m out of words.”

Chair Ryan Petty asked if anyone from ACPS was at the meeting, and Sims said he didn’t see anyone.

Kamoutsas: “There are 67 school districts in this state, and while I’m certain they’re not perfect, there’s only one that is failing repeatedly in its mission, having been referred to this board multiple times for corrective action.”

Kamoutsas said, “There’s no other district that we’ve essentially had to put on probation. So there’s a repeated pattern there, and it’s one that I want to assure this Board we do not take lightly. There are 67 school districts in this state, and while I’m certain they’re not perfect, there’s only one that is failing repeatedly in its mission, having been referred to this board multiple times for corrective action.”

Kamoutsas: “I think we will invite Vice Chair Certain for our November State Board of Education Meeting,… to provide clarity and context as to what race had to do with her views on Charlie Kirk and his horrific assassination, and whether those views… impact her decision-making and service as a School Board Member — that is, if she’s still serving on the Alachua Board at that time.”

Kamoutsas continued, “I think we will invite Vice Chair Certain for our November State Board of Education Meeting, assuming the Board is okay with that, to provide clarity and context as to what race had to do with her views on Charlie Kirk and his horrific assassination, and whether those views… impact her decision-making and service as a school board member — that is, if she’s still serving on the Alachua Board at that time. Given the latest example of malfeasance, neglect of duty, and, honestly, overall failure in leadership, a career change on her part would hardly come as a surprise.”

Chair Ryan Petty: “This has risen, in my view, to crisis level. This is a board that has complete disregard for operating as the oversight for the Alachua School District.”

Petty said, “I was sent copies of the social media posts by members of the community in Alachua. This has risen, in my view, to crisis level. This is a board that has complete disregard for operating as the oversight for the Alachua School District. We see the chaos reflected in the continuous back and forth between School Improvement — to C, to back, you know, it’s absolutely chaos. It means, Mr. Sims, that the important work of the Board, that they were elected to do for the citizens of Alachua County, is not happening, and in addition to that, they are alienating a large portion of the community and the families that they are there to serve. It’s beyond troubling. And Board Member Magar, I echo what you said: This board will not sit idle while that happens. We have families that are literally losing out on educational opportunities in Alachua County because of a dysfunctional Board.”

Petty agreed to invite Certain to the Board’s November meeting: “It’s clear to me, based on her social media posts, that she did not get the message at the last Board meeting, did not understand the reason that she was brought in front of the Board and understand that her responsibility is to ensure that that meeting is run with decorum and order and that all views are able to be represented… In November, we’ll have some additional questions for her and an opportunity to see if she can take some instruction the second time.”

BOE Member Daniel Foganholid: “I’m convinced that this is what we call clout-chasing. A lot of these Board Members have no name recognition, and if they do something to get the attention of the Commissioner or the Governor or the community,… then they get corrected. Then all of a sudden, they’re on CNN being a victim.”

BOE Member Daniel Foganholi said, “When it comes to these Board meetings,… a majority of the time, we’re talking about adult problems and adults that don’t know how to act… We [addressed] that… in the last meeting: if it’s a mistake and a true mistake, we show grace. This is not a mistake. I’m convinced that this is what we call clout-chasing. A lot of these Board Members have no name recognition, and if they do something to get the attention of the Commissioner or the Governor or the community, to get 500-plus complaints on saying something, then they get corrected. Then all of a sudden, they’re on CNN being a victim. They know what they’re doing. These Board Members know what they’re doing. All of a sudden, I’m a victim on the evening news. And then all of a sudden, you’ll see next year, somebody’s running for higher office… I don’t think it’s an accident… It’s about clout-chasing.”

Foganholi: “If you replaced that word right there, ‘white boy,’ with ‘brown boy’ or ‘black boy,’ it’s outrage. I don’t care if it’s reverse racism; racism is racism.”

Foganholi continued, “I go back to the point of people wanting to be activists on school boards, and the community has had enough, and again, the people suffering are the children. It’s the kids. We’re not focused on kids’ student achievement… We’re spending time on garbage like this Facebook post… If you replaced that word right there, ‘white boy,’ with ‘brown boy’ or ‘black boy,’ it’s outrage. I don’t care if it’s reverse racism; racism is racism… We have to be aggressive,… just have to get it back on track that Board Members are focused on children.”

Petty: “What can be done with the School Board? I, quite frankly, am of the opinion that somebody who would write that and post it on Facebook doesn’t belong on a state board of any district in the state. That’s irresponsible. I think we’ve had enough.”

Petty concluded, “Commissioner, you obviously can sense the temperature of the Board here, where — we would like to focus on things that improve educational opportunities and outcomes for the students in Florida, [but] we’re spending time on… deliberate Facebook posts that alienate members of the community, and we’ve heard from Mr. Sims that the Board meetings are not run effectively. Commissioner, I’d like to ask you, as a Board, to look into options prior to the November meeting: What can be done with the School Board? I, quite frankly, am of the opinion that somebody who would write that and post it on Facebook doesn’t belong on a state board of any district in the state. That’s irresponsible. I think we’ve had enough, so if you’ll look into that — and pending other options, I’d like Vice Chair Certain to appear before the Board in November.”

The Board took a break, and when they returned, Petty asked Kamoutsas for a recommendation on the next steps if the SESIR data is not received: “I don’t want to minimize what we just heard. It’s one thing, though, to run a sloppy and dysfunctional Board meeting. It’s quite another to violate state law, and that SESIR data, as the Board in Alachua should be aware, is critical to understanding whether or not there are school safety issues in the county. So we have an entire county of students potentially at risk from a Board that refuses to comply with state law.”

Petty: “I am sitting here on this Board as a parent of a student that was murdered in school because a district didn’t take school safety seriously, and I’m not going to sit on this Board and allow another school district in the state of Florida to flaunt state law and disregard the safety of their students.”

Petty, who is the father of a student who was murdered at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in 2018, continued: “I don’t have a word for how frustrated and upset I am about that. I am sitting here on this Board as a parent of a student that was murdered in school because a district didn’t take school safety seriously, and I’m not going to sit on this Board and allow another school district in the state of Florida to flaunt state law and disregard the safety of their students. Commissioner, I’d like options.”

Chancellor Paul Burns said a notice was sent to the district on September 23, informing them that they were out of compliance by not reporting SESIR data, and the district was given three days to respond. Kamoutsas said he would be willing to call an emergency virtual meeting of the BOE if a response is not received. (As stated above, ACPS says it has sent the SESIR data.)

Appeal of charter for Newberry Community School

Later in the meeting, the board took up a motion from the Newberry Community School to dismiss ACPS’s appeal of the charter granted to the charter conversion school, for lack of jurisdiction.

Adam Emerson, Executive Director of the Office of School Choice, said the Board would need to vote on two matters: 1) Whether to grant or deny the Newberry Community School’s motion to dismiss, and 2) Whether to approve the Charter School Appeal Commission’s decision to deny ACPS’s appeal and grant the conversion charter application.

Attorney for Newberry Community School: “There is no provision for districts who appeal an approval, yet Alachua has.”

Shawn Arnold from the Arnold Law Firm represented Newberry Community School, which he said was “the first conversion charter school in Florida in recent memory.” He said the Alachua County School Board has no express right to appeal the approval of the conversion charter school application: “While districts may give input once the Charter School Review Commission (CSRC) has given approval of the application, the district must then extend a charter application to the school. The only appeals permitted are those which are under the charter statute — those coming from the denial of a charter application by the CSRC. There is no provision for districts who appeal an approval, yet Alachua has.”

Arnold continued, “Alachua County argues that the statute is unfair. That is not something that comes before you; that is something that goes to the legislature. Even if Alachua County had the right to appeal, this filing was late. The CSRC gave its written approval on March 10; assuming that there was authority under the charter statute to grant Alachua County’s appeal, the School Board had only 30 days to do that. That deadline was April 9. The School Board filed instead on April 30.”

Arnold concluded, “Our ask to you is this: number one, agree with us that the motion to dismiss should be granted. And number two, say that even if we were in error in saying that the motion to dismiss should be granted, even if we did go through the appeal, you should find that the appeal would have been denied. I’ll leave you with this: there are more than 20 applications that have been submitted to the CSRC. One has been approved, and that is Newberry’s. That underscores the rigor of the CSRC’s review of charter applications and also shows the strength of this particular application.” 

Attorney for ACPS: Appeal was not filed late, and district’s objections to the charter applications were not addressed

Amy Envall from Sniffen and Spellman represented the SBAC and argued that decisions of the CRSC “may be appealed in accordance with [Florida statute] 1002.33.” She said that although the Charter School Review Commission announced their decision to grant the charter on March 10, there was a letter from the Department of Education on April 2 that confirmed the decision and said it could be appealed within 30 days; she said the School Board “received confirmation from the General Counsel that that was 30 days from the date of the letter, so that would be 30 days from April 2,… so we’re considering that to be timely filed.”

Envall also said the district believed the Florida Charter Institute did not conduct a “rigorous, objective review of the application” and did not adequately respond to the district’s objections: “Whether the School Board’s position is right, wrong, indifferent, petty, material or immaterial, no matter what, it deserved the attention and it deserves a response, and a single sentence in the summary comment does not address those concerns.”

DOE General Counsel: “It’s the Department’s position that the legislature’s intent was to make sure that any charter appeals or charter reviews were going to be done specifically through the Review Commission, the Appeal Commission, and ultimately the State Board. And then if the parties wanted to continue to litigate, then that would be subject to going up to the First District Court of Appeal.”

Department of Education General Counsel David Chappell said, “This is the first time that the Review Commission has issued a recommendation on a school, and it is the first time that we have had a school district appeal that recommendation… There is no language in the Appeal Commission statute that expressly addresses what happens when the Review Commission decides to approve a school and the district wants to challenge that… It’s the Department’s position that the legislature’s intent was to make sure that any charter appeals or charter reviews were going to be done specifically through the Review Commission, the Appeal Commission, and ultimately the State Board. And then if the parties wanted to continue to litigate, then that would be subject to going up to the First District Court of Appeal.”

Chappell recommended that the Board deny to motion to dismiss: “If you deny the motion to dismiss, you would then have jurisdiction to rule on whether to agree with the recommendation for Newberry to convert to a charter school. If you grant the motion to dismiss, then you would not need to take any further action on that, and that particular Appeal Commission recommendation would not be before you. The Department’s recommendation is that you deny the motion to dismiss and then you adopt the recommendation of the Charter Appeal Commission to affirm Newberry converting to a charter school.”

Motions

Byrd made a motion to deny Newberry Community School’s motion to dismiss, and Foganholi seconded the motion; the motion was unanimously approved.

Byrd then made a motion to uphold the Charter School Appeal Commission recommendation to deny the appeal of the School Board of Alachua County and grant the conversion charter application filed by Newberry Community School. The motion was seconded by Foganholi, and the motion was approved unanimously.